I recently called them up with a coverage problem. The script the guys in India are following seems to mandate me sending the handset back to them. There was no way the symptoms I described could be related to the handset – “I've put them SIM in a different handset and it still has the same problem” – but they wouldn't listen.

Very amusing conversation followed a couple of days later with a chappy in the handset repair team in scotland along the lines of:

3: “We're very sorry, but we can't find anything wrong with your handset”
M: “I'm not surprised, I did tell the guy but he insisted I send it to you”
3: “What problem were you having?”
M: “no signal, dropped calls, that kind of thing”
3: ???

And while I get the element of self care thing, that doesn't absolve the operator of their responsibilities. It's (admittedly) worse for Three, because I can't stick their SIM in any old POS handset I might happen to have lying around. But that's their choice – if they didn't say things like “we might chuck you off if you persist in using a non 3G handset” then I might not be so keen to have an appropriate handset.

I did pay via credit card there and then, not least since I had no option. I get the upside of cash back on my card, but it's still a pain. The bigger pain is when you hit that limit while you're travelling and/or actually scheduled to make a call. I asked if they could setup automatic CNP transactions for when I get close to my limt; again not an option.

So the upshot is that the operator makes it hard for someone who wants to spend a large amount of money with them. And when i'm spending that sort of money, that sort of service doesn't cut it for me.

And I don't care about the costs involved in them managing replacement handsets. As a consumer, I have a right to expect that when I buy something, it works. And it's up to the retailer, in this case Three, to manage their suppliers, in this case Nokia, correctly. And if they don't factor that into their costs, that is not my problem.

I recently called them up with a coverage problem. The script the guys in India are following seems to mandate me sending the handset back to them. There was no way the symptoms I described could be related to the handset – “I've put them SIM in a different handset and it still has the same problem” – but they wouldn't listen.

Very amusing conversation followed a couple of days later with a chappy in the handset repair team in scotland along the lines of:

3: “We're very sorry, but we can't find anything wrong with your handset”
M: “I'm not surprised, I did tell the guy but he insisted I send it to you”
3: “What problem were you having?”
M: “no signal, dropped calls, that kind of thing”
3: ???

And while I get the element of self care thing, that doesn't absolve the operator of their responsibilities. It's (admittedly) worse for Three, because I can't stick their SIM in any old POS handset I might happen to have lying around. But that's their choice – if they didn't say things like “we might chuck you off if you persist in using a non 3G handset” then I might not be so keen to have an appropriate handset.

I did pay via credit card there and then, not least since I had no option. I get the upside of cash back on my card, but it's still a pain. The bigger pain is when you hit that limit while you're travelling and/or actually scheduled to make a call. I asked if they could setup automatic CNP transactions for when I get close to my limt; again not an option.

So the upshot is that the operator makes it hard for someone who wants to spend a large amount of money with them. And when i'm spending that sort of money, that sort of service doesn't cut it for me.

And I don't care about the costs involved in them managing replacement handsets. As a consumer, I have a right to expect that when I buy something, it works. And it's up to the retailer, in this case Three, to manage their suppliers, in this case Nokia, correctly. And if they don't factor that into their costs, that is not my problem.

I recently called them up with a coverage problem. The script the guys in India are following seems to mandate me sending the handset back to them. There was no way the symptoms I described could be related to the handset – “I've put them SIM in a different handset and it still has the same problem” – but they wouldn't listen.

Very amusing conversation followed a couple of days later with a chappy in the handset repair team in scotland along the lines of:

3: “We're very sorry, but we can't find anything wrong with your handset”
M: “I'm not surprised, I did tell the guy but he insisted I send it to you”
3: “What problem were you having?”
M: “no signal, dropped calls, that kind of thing”
3: ???

I did pay via credit card there and then, not least since I had no option. I get the upside of cash back on my card, but it's still a pain. The bigger pain is when you hit that limit while you're travelling and/or actually scheduled to make a call. I asked if they could setup automatic CNP transactions for when I get close to my limt; again not an option.

So the upshot is that the operator makes it hard for someone who wants to spend a large amount of money with them. And when i'm spending that sort of money, that sort of service doesn't cut it for me.

And I don't care about the costs involved in them managing replacement handsets. As a consumer, I have a right to expect that when I buy something, it works. And it's up to the retailer, in this case Three, to manage their suppliers, in this case Nokia, correctly. And if they don't factor that into their costs, that is not my problem.

As Ewan says, covering every contingency costs real money. Every business – garages, bike shops, TV retailers – has to decide what level of replacement service to offer. As a consumer – and as Ewan rightly points out – you benefit from 3's reduced cost base 99.99% of the time. When the wheels fall off, you then have an element of self-care required.

I know someone who works at 3UK, and they take the returns/repair process very seriously. Every returned handset costs them a lot of money, as phone technicians and labs don't pay for themselves. With some 30% of returned handsets not exhibiting any real fault beyond end-user numptyness, it's a loss leader for MNO's.

/m

There was a brief period when 3UK sold USIM's that weren't locked to handsets with a 3G radio in the USIM profile. If you've got one of these then yes, you can pop it into a non-3G handset and away you go.

/m

Malcolm, if you were spending 20.00 per month exactly, I'd have said that's par for the course for an operator such as 3.

The fact that you routinely spend 100+ per month and on some occasions, a lot more, should have afforded some flexibility from the 3 call centre. Unfortunately that's not entirely how they seem to work. Remember it's a third party call centre managing your service on behalf of 3UK. They have to work with the policies they've been given.

There is, however, a reason they're able to provide you 1100 minutes at twenty quid a month.. their costs are strictly controlled — giving you a temporary 300 quid or 500 quid handset isn't an easy ask.

I think you'd find Vodafone a lot more flexible — but, a heck of a lot *more* expensive.

I suppose one of the problems is that people might accidentally 'borrow' the loan device on a permanent basis. Surely the repaired device could go back to the store and then you swap the loan device for your original.

As stated previously by Mike42, I would have just made a payment via credit/debit card. Yes it is annoying but I think that negative is very much outweighed by many the positives of being with 3.

If you think 3 has breached its obligations under sale of goods legislation (fit for purpose etc) then you could use the small claims court process which is fairly simple.

3 SIMs do work in at least some GSM handsets.

/m

I do tend to agree that it wouldn't kill operators to hang on to a few trade-in handsets and let people use them while theirs are being repaired. After all, give them an older unit and it's not like they're not going to bring it back for their shiny new(ish) one…

Q: why not just make the card payment?

You are quite right, the credit limit is there to protect the company. I don't see how this is any different to any other firm effectively extending you credit (in the form of minutes) and drawing the line somewhere. The MNO's are on to a looser here, as if they don't control credit limits they get it in the neck from both their investors and the public when phones are used by children or internationally (“Orange customer in