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	<title>Comments on: Mobile Network App Stores: Utter, utter rubbish today</title>
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	<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html</link>
	<description>Daily news and opinion for 250,000 industry executives and mobile fanatics</description>
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		<title>By: Alex Kerr</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-242128</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Kerr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:05:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-242128</guid>
		<description>I know I big up the potential of Ovi store above, but I completely agree with you James. Download! showed how bad Nokia can make things. They really have NO excuse not to make a good job of Ovi Store on either S60 or S40, and quite frankly make it as attractive and easy as iPhone appstore. If they fail on this, they fully deserve the consequences. It&#039;ll just be a shame for all the developers, and the potential. But still, lets wait and see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know I big up the potential of Ovi store above, but I completely agree with you James. Download! showed how bad Nokia can make things. They really have NO excuse not to make a good job of Ovi Store on either S60 or S40, and quite frankly make it as attractive and easy as iPhone appstore. If they fail on this, they fully deserve the consequences. It&#39;ll just be a shame for all the developers, and the potential. But still, lets wait and see.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Kerr</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237573</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Kerr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:05:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237573</guid>
		<description>I know I big up the potential of Ovi store above, but I completely agree with you James. Download! showed how bad Nokia can make things. They really have NO excuse not to make a good job of Ovi Store on either S60 or S40, and quite frankly make it as attractive and easy as iPhone appstore. If they fail on this, they fully deserve the consequences. It&#039;ll just be a shame for all the developers, and the potential. But still, lets wait and see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know I big up the potential of Ovi store above, but I completely agree with you James. Download! showed how bad Nokia can make things. They really have NO excuse not to make a good job of Ovi Store on either S60 or S40, and quite frankly make it as attractive and easy as iPhone appstore. If they fail on this, they fully deserve the consequences. It&#39;ll just be a shame for all the developers, and the potential. But still, lets wait and see.</p>
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		<title>By: James Lai</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-242121</link>
		<dc:creator>James Lai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:05:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-242121</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;says http://tinyurl.com/dbzmd5 (Mobile operator&#039;s App Store) seems not gonna work http://plurk.com/p/j2drx&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/jameslai001/status/1309923186&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">says <a href="http://tinyurl.com/dbzmd5" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/dbzmd5</a> (Mobile operator&#8217;s App Store) seems not gonna work <a href="http://plurk.com/p/j2drx" rel="nofollow">http://plurk.com/p/j2drx</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/jameslai001/status/1309923186">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html">Topsy page</a>]</div>
<p></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: James Lai</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-247897</link>
		<dc:creator>James Lai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 05:05:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-247897</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;says http://tinyurl.com/dbzmd5 (Mobile operator&#039;s App Store) seems not gonna work http://plurk.com/p/j2drx&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">says <a href="http://tinyurl.com/dbzmd5" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/dbzmd5</a> (Mobile operator&#8217;s App Store) seems not gonna work <a href="http://plurk.com/p/j2drx" rel="nofollow">http://plurk.com/p/j2drx</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Mike Bradshaw</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237519</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Bradshaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 20:37:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237519</guid>
		<description>did not know that (BTW, how do you get at WAP pages ;) don&#039;t think i ever visited them when in UK, not even sure if any FI operator even has them!)&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I think as Alex Kerr points out above, T-Mobile may have the best idea - Nokia builds &amp; maintains the App Store, T-Mobile brands, bills and does customer support.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>did not know that (BTW, how do you get at WAP pages <img src='http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  don&#39;t think i ever visited them when in UK, not even sure if any FI operator even has them!)</p>
<p>I think as Alex Kerr points out above, T-Mobile may have the best idea &#8211; Nokia builds &#038; maintains the App Store, T-Mobile brands, bills and does customer support.</p>
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		<title>By: James Whatley</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237518</link>
		<dc:creator>James Whatley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 20:35:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237518</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://dirtyaura.org/blog/2009/03/10/mobiledevcamp-slides-platform-stage/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://dirtyaura.org/blog/2009/03/10/mobiledevc...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Via @Mike Bradshaw and Teemu Kurrpa.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Says. It. All.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://dirtyaura.org/blog/2009/03/10/mobiledevcamp-slides-platform-stage/" rel="nofollow">http://dirtyaura.org/blog/2009/03/10/mobiledevc&#8230;</a></p>
<p>Via @Mike Bradshaw and Teemu Kurrpa.</p>
<p>Says. It. All.</p>
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		<title>By: Ewan @ MIR</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237516</link>
		<dc:creator>Ewan @ MIR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 19:22:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237516</guid>
		<description>Mike, you know the Orange portal still has &#039;THIS IS A FREE PAGE&#039; on top of most of it&#039;s wap pages....   SCARING every customer into being very, very careful about what they click on!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike, you know the Orange portal still has &#39;THIS IS A FREE PAGE&#39; on top of most of it&#39;s wap pages&#8230;.   SCARING every customer into being very, very careful about what they click on!</p>
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		<title>By: James Whatley</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237514</link>
		<dc:creator>James Whatley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 19:01:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237514</guid>
		<description>The key point there Ewan is - &quot;Two clicks and I&#039;m downloading it.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Apple&#039;s iPhone kicked the ass out of Nokia Download! and anything else that went before it by way of sheer ease of use along. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I would love, love, love the Ovi store to be amazing. I really hope it is. &lt;br&gt;But it the &#039;store&#039; isn&#039;t immediately obvious to your average joe, on a device that *begs* you to play with it and find out more/explore then it has no chance. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Apple put the App store on the &#039;home&#039; page. They made it easy to browse, easy to buy and easy to download &amp; install... I mean, you&#039;ve seen *that* TV ad right? &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.tellyads.com/show_movie.php?filename=TA7328&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.tellyads.com/show_movie.php?filename...&lt;/a&gt; &lt;--- yeah, that one. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If Ovi and/or Android can come anywhere near the bar set by Apple, then they might, MIGHT have a chance at emulating Apple&#039;s success. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I don&#039;t care if _everyone in the world_ has an &#039;Ovi store enabled&#039; handset - if the UI sucks, they won&#039;t sell a damn thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The key point there Ewan is &#8211; &#8220;Two clicks and I&#39;m downloading it.&#8221;</p>
<p>Apple&#39;s iPhone kicked the ass out of Nokia Download! and anything else that went before it by way of sheer ease of use along. </p>
<p>I would love, love, love the Ovi store to be amazing. I really hope it is. <br />But it the &#39;store&#39; isn&#39;t immediately obvious to your average joe, on a device that *begs* you to play with it and find out more/explore then it has no chance. </p>
<p>Apple put the App store on the &#39;home&#39; page. They made it easy to browse, easy to buy and easy to download &#038; install&#8230; I mean, you&#39;ve seen *that* TV ad right? </p>
<p><a href="http://www.tellyads.com/show_movie.php?filename=TA7328" rel="nofollow">http://www.tellyads.com/show_movie.php?filename&#8230;</a> &lt;&#8212; yeah, that one. </p>
<p>If Ovi and/or Android can come anywhere near the bar set by Apple, then they might, MIGHT have a chance at emulating Apple&#39;s success. </p>
<p>I don&#39;t care if _everyone in the world_ has an &#39;Ovi store enabled&#39; handset &#8211; if the UI sucks, they won&#39;t sell a damn thing.</p>
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		<title>By: mob4hire</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-242122</link>
		<dc:creator>mob4hire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:57:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-242122</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;RT &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/twitter/DominicTravers&quot;&gt;@DominicTravers&lt;/a&gt; great mobile dev debate on MIR... http://is.gd/mJXP &amp; http://is.gd/mJYw&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/mob4hire/status/1306749790&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">RT <a href="http://topsy.com/twitter/DominicTravers">@DominicTravers</a> great mobile dev debate on MIR&#8230; <a href="http://is.gd/mJXP" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJXP</a> &#038; <a href="http://is.gd/mJYw" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJYw</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/mob4hire/status/1306749790">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html">Topsy page</a>]</div>
<p></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Mike Bradshaw</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237511</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Bradshaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:49:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237511</guid>
		<description>this is just a suspicion, but i have not seen any numbers to confirm or deny it, but the apparent success is due to two things;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;1) The vast majority of iPhone purchasers have at least one other (if not multiple) Apple products, so already had a working iTunes and were bought into the apple view of the world&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;2) most of the Maciban (those people for who life is on hold waiting for Sir Steve of Jobs to make announcements), are willing to *pay* *MONEY* for things as long as they are pretty. In fact the Maciban may be the solution to the global financial crisis ;)&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Most Normobs have been trained by the operators to never click or download things, as doing so is likely to lead to a giant bill the next month, so even though their S40 phone *could* in theory support lots of apps, the only thing they buy are ring-tones and wallpapers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this is just a suspicion, but i have not seen any numbers to confirm or deny it, but the apparent success is due to two things;</p>
<p>1) The vast majority of iPhone purchasers have at least one other (if not multiple) Apple products, so already had a working iTunes and were bought into the apple view of the world</p>
<p>2) most of the Maciban (those people for who life is on hold waiting for Sir Steve of Jobs to make announcements), are willing to *pay* *MONEY* for things as long as they are pretty. In fact the Maciban may be the solution to the global financial crisis <img src='http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Most Normobs have been trained by the operators to never click or download things, as doing so is likely to lead to a giant bill the next month, so even though their S40 phone *could* in theory support lots of apps, the only thing they buy are ring-tones and wallpapers.</p>
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		<title>By: dominictravers</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-242123</link>
		<dc:creator>dominictravers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:00:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-242123</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;Crikey, it&#039;s all going on this week, great mobile dev debate on MIR... http://is.gd/mJXP &amp; http://is.gd/mJYw just spent 2+ hours writing too&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/dominictravers/status/1306482678&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">Crikey, it&#8217;s all going on this week, great mobile dev debate on MIR&#8230; <a href="http://is.gd/mJXP" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJXP</a> &#038; <a href="http://is.gd/mJYw" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJYw</a> just spent 2+ hours writing too</span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/dominictravers/status/1306482678">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html">Topsy page</a>]</div>
<p></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Romi Parmar</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-253340</link>
		<dc:creator>Romi Parmar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 16:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-253340</guid>
		<description>Agree with Joshr&#039; sentiments completely and thought my story might help some developers reading this:

Ewan is completely right about the &quot;50 million customers. 49 million of which couldn’t give a flying flip about downloading applications&quot;.

My method was to start with a mobile web application that detects and works on every browser ie. on a mobile or a PC. Then if someone wants to access your site using their mobile they must already know about accessing the web with their mobile. The trick is not to force them to download, save, wait for a text or open anything until they have had an experience of your service.

Focus on the small percent of people who have a capable phone (thankfully it is a bit higher than the 2% Ewan referred to) as they are customers who have the greatest propensity to pay for mobile content. I&#039;ve managed this by simply calling my mobile dating site The 3G Dating Agency.  Some early critics would say this was limiting of my potential customer base but to customers it&#039;s very helpful because it makes it quite obvious that if they&#039;ve got a Nokia 3000 series mobile using this service is probably not going to be possible. But pop down to a local retailer and buy a 3G Phone and a data plan and they&#039;ll be all set to go. 

Help the customer to help you so for example if they need to upgrade their mobile or get a data plan to use your service try and do a deal with a mobile phone retailer. We did this with a leading UK retailer (www.phones4u.co.uk/3gdating) and it means customers can benefit from an extra £30 of FREE credit when they buy any new phone or data plan.

Hope this is of some help...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree with Joshr&#8217; sentiments completely and thought my story might help some developers reading this:</p>
<p>Ewan is completely right about the &#8220;50 million customers. 49 million of which couldn’t give a flying flip about downloading applications&#8221;.</p>
<p>My method was to start with a mobile web application that detects and works on every browser ie. on a mobile or a PC. Then if someone wants to access your site using their mobile they must already know about accessing the web with their mobile. The trick is not to force them to download, save, wait for a text or open anything until they have had an experience of your service.</p>
<p>Focus on the small percent of people who have a capable phone (thankfully it is a bit higher than the 2% Ewan referred to) as they are customers who have the greatest propensity to pay for mobile content. I&#8217;ve managed this by simply calling my mobile dating site The 3G Dating Agency.  Some early critics would say this was limiting of my potential customer base but to customers it&#8217;s very helpful because it makes it quite obvious that if they&#8217;ve got a Nokia 3000 series mobile using this service is probably not going to be possible. But pop down to a local retailer and buy a 3G Phone and a data plan and they&#8217;ll be all set to go. </p>
<p>Help the customer to help you so for example if they need to upgrade their mobile or get a data plan to use your service try and do a deal with a mobile phone retailer. We did this with a leading UK retailer (www.phones4u.co.uk/3gdating) and it means customers can benefit from an extra £30 of FREE credit when they buy any new phone or data plan.</p>
<p>Hope this is of some help&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Ewan @ MIR</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237500</link>
		<dc:creator>Ewan @ MIR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 15:42:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237500</guid>
		<description>Alex, kudos on the reply.  I never maintain that iTunes is the Golden Goose.  There are flaws.  But if you&#039;re a developer and you simply HAVE to make a return -- SOME KIND of return, it&#039;s iTunes, iTunes, iTunes.  With an excited eye on Ovi, possibly Blackberry and Android.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;It&#039;s not about being in the top 25 iPhone Apps.  Not necessarily.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If I read about a simply brilliant application that allows me to [do something, whatever] -- and if I read it on your blog, Alex, I&#039;d have an EASY method of discovery.  Two clicks and I&#039;m downloading it.  And then I&#039;m telling everyone and their dog about it too. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Ovi looks promising, it really does.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alex, kudos on the reply.  I never maintain that iTunes is the Golden Goose.  There are flaws.  But if you&#39;re a developer and you simply HAVE to make a return &#8212; SOME KIND of return, it&#39;s iTunes, iTunes, iTunes.  With an excited eye on Ovi, possibly Blackberry and Android.</p>
<p>It&#39;s not about being in the top 25 iPhone Apps.  Not necessarily.  </p>
<p>If I read about a simply brilliant application that allows me to [do something, whatever] &#8212; and if I read it on your blog, Alex, I&#39;d have an EASY method of discovery.  Two clicks and I&#39;m downloading it.  And then I&#39;m telling everyone and their dog about it too. </p>
<p>Ovi looks promising, it really does.</p>
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		<title>By: ilicco</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237497</link>
		<dc:creator>ilicco</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 15:11:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237497</guid>
		<description>i am behind you all the way Ewan - so what do we do about it. We need to take this a step forward, not just complain about the state of play.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i am behind you all the way Ewan &#8211; so what do we do about it. We need to take this a step forward, not just complain about the state of play.</p>
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		<title>By: joshr</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237494</link>
		<dc:creator>joshr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 14:03:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237494</guid>
		<description>just an awesome article Ewan.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;total respect to you, and MIR in general, for being honest, open, and taking the fight to the industry.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;you got balls dude.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>just an awesome article Ewan.</p>
<p>total respect to you, and MIR in general, for being honest, open, and taking the fight to the industry.</p>
<p>you got balls dude.</p>
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		<title>By: mob4hire</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-247956</link>
		<dc:creator>mob4hire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 13:57:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-247956</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;RT &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/twitter/DominicTravers&quot;&gt;@DominicTravers&lt;/a&gt; great mobile dev debate on MIR... http://is.gd/mJXP &amp; http://is.gd/mJYw&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">RT <a href="http://topsy.com/twitter/DominicTravers">@DominicTravers</a> great mobile dev debate on MIR&#8230; <a href="http://is.gd/mJXP" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJXP</a> &#038; <a href="http://is.gd/mJYw" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJYw</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: dominictravers</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-248003</link>
		<dc:creator>dominictravers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 13:00:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-248003</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;Crikey, it&#039;s all going on this week, great mobile dev debate on MIR... http://is.gd/mJXP &amp; http://is.gd/mJYw just spent 2+ hours writing too&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">Crikey, it&#8217;s all going on this week, great mobile dev debate on MIR&#8230; <a href="http://is.gd/mJXP" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJXP</a> &#038; <a href="http://is.gd/mJYw" rel="nofollow">http://is.gd/mJYw</a> just spent 2+ hours writing too</span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Alex Kerr</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-253336</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Kerr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 12:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-253336</guid>
		<description>Ewan, yes totally agree with all you say about operator app stores. Clearly the numbers touted by them are outright lies (e.g. the 50 million), even if they don&#039;t realise that, they&#039;re just towing the party line.

It has got to be one of the biggest ironies in the world today that mobile network operators are among the people who understand mobile the least, or rather what mobile has become. (Heresy! Burn me at the stake!). They think it&#039;s about network interfaces, and voice calls. Yeah, sure it is. But it&#039;s also about mobiles being the next gen of personal computer, about software and services - that work, that are open, that are easy, that are accessible to developers (to develop) and users (to use) alike. And operators REALLY don&#039;t get this. People within them do, but not as a whole corporate mindset that actually changes things. I mean, just on the mobile web front, the amount of transcoder abuse that seriously damages developer efforts and user experience, is INCREASING. Despite the cries of developers and users.

Anyway. Agreed on the platform priorities - for today. iPhone 1st, then Ovi (but not launched yet), then Android. But it will not be long before Ovi will be unreachably out in front. The numbers alone across S40 and S60 will make Ovi store vastly more rewarding than iPhone. Based on what we know of Ovi store today.

One solution for operators will be for the existing big name app stores who know what they&#039;re doing, to run the operator app stores. So T-Mobile in the UK have the right idea with their recent announcement that Nokia&#039;s Ovi Store will power (or be rebranded as) the T-Mobile UK app store. That&#039;s more like it. If this works, other operators should follow the same model - and actually specifically use Ovi Store as that will net the greatest rewards.

Finally, it would be a real fallacy to think that all is bright and breezy in iPhone apps land. Cos it really, really isn&#039;t. And discoverability is part of the problem. There are now so many apps in the app store, that most developers have a real struggle to be found. In your example, you *knew the name* and what the app did, so of course you found it quickly. Most apps are not already known by most of their potential users. That&#039;s Huge Problem 1. Huge Problem 2 is Apple&#039;s app approval process is now completely out of control and collapsing rapidly.
Read this:
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/03/07/would_be_iphone_developers_pulling_their_hair_out_by_the_roots.html
and this:
http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2009/03/apple-has-no-clue-whats-going-on-with-dev-contracts.ars

in short, new apps have a monumental struggle to even get in the iPhone app store. Let alone be discovered somehow. And if an app can&#039;t be discovered in the iPhone app store without being super popular already, or the name known, then a developer is looking at a huge and expensive marketing campaign. And where&#039;s the money coming from for that?

iPhone app store is not the goose that lays the golden eggs that you and others think it is I&#039;m afraid Ewan. As a developer I&#039;m betting on Ovi app store, as the numbers alone (300-400 million new *potential* customers a year, for content that&#039;s not just apps) mean far greater chance of success, and ROI.

Alex
phonething.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ewan, yes totally agree with all you say about operator app stores. Clearly the numbers touted by them are outright lies (e.g. the 50 million), even if they don&#8217;t realise that, they&#8217;re just towing the party line.</p>
<p>It has got to be one of the biggest ironies in the world today that mobile network operators are among the people who understand mobile the least, or rather what mobile has become. (Heresy! Burn me at the stake!). They think it&#8217;s about network interfaces, and voice calls. Yeah, sure it is. But it&#8217;s also about mobiles being the next gen of personal computer, about software and services &#8211; that work, that are open, that are easy, that are accessible to developers (to develop) and users (to use) alike. And operators REALLY don&#8217;t get this. People within them do, but not as a whole corporate mindset that actually changes things. I mean, just on the mobile web front, the amount of transcoder abuse that seriously damages developer efforts and user experience, is INCREASING. Despite the cries of developers and users.</p>
<p>Anyway. Agreed on the platform priorities &#8211; for today. iPhone 1st, then Ovi (but not launched yet), then Android. But it will not be long before Ovi will be unreachably out in front. The numbers alone across S40 and S60 will make Ovi store vastly more rewarding than iPhone. Based on what we know of Ovi store today.</p>
<p>One solution for operators will be for the existing big name app stores who know what they&#8217;re doing, to run the operator app stores. So T-Mobile in the UK have the right idea with their recent announcement that Nokia&#8217;s Ovi Store will power (or be rebranded as) the T-Mobile UK app store. That&#8217;s more like it. If this works, other operators should follow the same model &#8211; and actually specifically use Ovi Store as that will net the greatest rewards.</p>
<p>Finally, it would be a real fallacy to think that all is bright and breezy in iPhone apps land. Cos it really, really isn&#8217;t. And discoverability is part of the problem. There are now so many apps in the app store, that most developers have a real struggle to be found. In your example, you *knew the name* and what the app did, so of course you found it quickly. Most apps are not already known by most of their potential users. That&#8217;s Huge Problem 1. Huge Problem 2 is Apple&#8217;s app approval process is now completely out of control and collapsing rapidly.<br />
Read this:<br />
<a href="http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/03/07/would_be_iphone_developers_pulling_their_hair_out_by_the_roots.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/03/07/would_be_iphone_developers_pulling_their_hair_out_by_the_roots.html</a><br />
and this:<br />
<a href="http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2009/03/apple-has-no-clue-whats-going-on-with-dev-contracts.ars" rel="nofollow">http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2009/03/apple-has-no-clue-whats-going-on-with-dev-contracts.ars</a></p>
<p>in short, new apps have a monumental struggle to even get in the iPhone app store. Let alone be discovered somehow. And if an app can&#8217;t be discovered in the iPhone app store without being super popular already, or the name known, then a developer is looking at a huge and expensive marketing campaign. And where&#8217;s the money coming from for that?</p>
<p>iPhone app store is not the goose that lays the golden eggs that you and others think it is I&#8217;m afraid Ewan. As a developer I&#8217;m betting on Ovi app store, as the numbers alone (300-400 million new *potential* customers a year, for content that&#8217;s not just apps) mean far greater chance of success, and ROI.</p>
<p>Alex<br />
phonething.com</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Radford</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237484</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Radford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 11:37:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237484</guid>
		<description>This why the Ovi Store is important - not only S60 but all sorts of downloadable content for S40 devices as well. More mileage out of old, crap phones.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This why the Ovi Store is important &#8211; not only S60 but all sorts of downloadable content for S40 devices as well. More mileage out of old, crap phones.</p>
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		<title>By: TerenceEden</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237483</link>
		<dc:creator>TerenceEden</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 11:26:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237483</guid>
		<description>The Apple Store isn&#039;t all roses - &lt;a href=&quot;http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/03/10/0157221&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/03/1...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt;As easy as it is to get stuff on there - a lot of it is rubbish.  You just need to read the reviews of the buggy apps that are out there.  While the User Interface is nice (for both sides) is the User Experience really that great?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Something else to consider - there are no shortage of old, crap phones.  Should we (as developers &amp; networks) cater to them or wait until they all upgrade to an iPhone?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;That&#039;s never going to happen.  Besides, people with crap phones still buy games, ringtones, apps, etc.  It&#039;s harder to develop for such a diverse range of underpowered devices - but I think it&#039;s a challenge worth taking up.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Operator app stores aren&#039;t wonderful - and it&#039;s hard to get your content on them.  We&#039;ve been too long in changing because we&#039;ve been focused on big deals with big companies.  That&#039;s no longer a perfect business model.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;T&lt;br&gt;[Not speaking for Vodafone, my benevolent employer]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Apple Store isn&#39;t all roses &#8211; <a href="http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/03/10/0157221" rel="nofollow">http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/03/1&#8230;</a><br />As easy as it is to get stuff on there &#8211; a lot of it is rubbish.  You just need to read the reviews of the buggy apps that are out there.  While the User Interface is nice (for both sides) is the User Experience really that great?</p>
<p>Something else to consider &#8211; there are no shortage of old, crap phones.  Should we (as developers &#038; networks) cater to them or wait until they all upgrade to an iPhone?</p>
<p>That&#39;s never going to happen.  Besides, people with crap phones still buy games, ringtones, apps, etc.  It&#39;s harder to develop for such a diverse range of underpowered devices &#8211; but I think it&#39;s a challenge worth taking up.</p>
<p>Operator app stores aren&#39;t wonderful &#8211; and it&#39;s hard to get your content on them.  We&#39;ve been too long in changing because we&#39;ve been focused on big deals with big companies.  That&#39;s no longer a perfect business model.</p>
<p>T<br />[Not speaking for Vodafone, my benevolent employer]</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-253335</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-253335</guid>
		<description>Nail on the head.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nail on the head.</p>
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		<title>By: stu_vaz</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-242124</link>
		<dc:creator>stu_vaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:52:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-242124</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;Retweeting &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/twitter/Ew4n&quot;&gt;@Ew4n&lt;/a&gt;: My mobile operator app diatribe.  Agree?  Violently disagree?  Let me know: http://s3nt.com/dsiq&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/stu_vaz/status/1304851044&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">Retweeting <a href="http://topsy.com/twitter/Ew4n">@Ew4n</a>: My mobile operator app diatribe.  Agree?  Violently disagree?  Let me know: <a href="http://s3nt.com/dsiq" rel="nofollow">http://s3nt.com/dsiq</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/stu_vaz/status/1304851044">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/tb/www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html">Topsy page</a>]</div>
<p></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: steveprocter</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237481</link>
		<dc:creator>steveprocter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:14:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237481</guid>
		<description>Yes I&#039;d like to see the results these days.  Back about 5 years ago we built a few java apps, including a London Underground one, and put it on a major UK operators portal. The downloads over an entire year were in the hundreds ;-(  Oh and yes, it took about 4 months of negotiations and contract signing before we got there. So how is 2009, have things got better?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes I&#39;d like to see the results these days.  Back about 5 years ago we built a few java apps, including a London Underground one, and put it on a major UK operators portal. The downloads over an entire year were in the hundreds ;-(  Oh and yes, it took about 4 months of negotiations and contract signing before we got there. So how is 2009, have things got better?</p>
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		<title>By: steveprocter</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237480</link>
		<dc:creator>steveprocter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:09:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237480</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve exclusively been able to do a deal with Trevor le Chateau, vice president of partner promotions &amp; baked beans, so that all java app developers can stick a poster on the wall of his cafe, promoting their app to the potential 6 million customers.....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#39;ve exclusively been able to do a deal with Trevor le Chateau, vice president of partner promotions &#038; baked beans, so that all java app developers can stick a poster on the wall of his cafe, promoting their app to the potential 6 million customers&#8230;..</p>
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		<title>By: MattRadford</title>
		<link>http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2009/03/mobile_network_app_stores_utter_utter_rubbish_today.html/comment-page-1#comment-237479</link>
		<dc:creator>MattRadford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 08:57:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/?p=15563#comment-237479</guid>
		<description>Or, you could compare the 100x100px rubbish Watchmen app for your bollocks Samsung, to the sheer class that is the Watchmen app released for the iPhone.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;There&#039;s a ton of great content included, mostly not needing connectivity. Lots of potential to do future movie purchase tie-ins... &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.allaboutiphone.net/2009/03/the-unborn-watchmen-and-interactive-mobile-billboards/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.allaboutiphone.net/2009/03/the-unbor...&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or, you could compare the 100x100px rubbish Watchmen app for your bollocks Samsung, to the sheer class that is the Watchmen app released for the iPhone.</p>
<p>There&#39;s a ton of great content included, mostly not needing connectivity. Lots of potential to do future movie purchase tie-ins&#8230; <a href="http://www.allaboutiphone.net/2009/03/the-unborn-watchmen-and-interactive-mobile-billboards/" rel="nofollow">http://www.allaboutiphone.net/2009/03/the-unbor&#8230;</a></p>
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